All season we’ve watched as Big Brother Houseguest Vanessa Rousso navigated the sides of the house while avoiding committing too deeply to one group or the other. Now at Final Five she will have to make that choice and split up a remaining alliance.
Caught between two sides with a showmance on one and a makeshift duo on the other Vanessa is now forced to choose between them as she prepares to make a big decision this week.
Vanessa is the new HoH and nominations have likely taken place inside the house, but we won’t know until the Feeds return much later tonight. Leading up to the meeting we were able to listen in as Vanessa prepared what she would say to the house.
Flashback to 9:46 AM BBT 9/11 as Vanessa practices her upcoming Nomination Ceremony speech where we expect she will put John and Steve on the Block.
I can’t tell you how tough this decision is. Coming in to this HoH I thought…
I never thought in a million years I’d consider going to Final Four with a known showmance and I started to think about the evidence I had before me and I soon realized that… I’m a fool to think that… [Restart]
It’s no secret that I’m in Final Five with two very strong duos. I’ve got a showmance on one side and I’ve got the Rockstars on the other. Steve and John, although you may not have a romance between you I feel that effectively I’m dealing with the same thing because I know when it comes down to it you’re always going to take each other to the finals over me if not out of loyalty then simply out of incentives…
Everybody at this table is a friend of mine… [inaudibles]
Vanessa trails off there, mumbles a few more lines, and then the Feeds cut.
It’s seems odd to consider a bond between John and Steve to be stronger than Austin and Liz, but it’s possible Vanessa would lose the “who to take?” choice to either of them in a given situation. Here she does seem to be taking the risk of sticking it out with the showmance of Austin and Liz. Or heck, maybe she’s setting up a smokescreen to see if she can take a surefire shot at the showmance but settling for the Rockstars as her backup.
I would have thought she’d have an easier time flipping John against Steve or vice versa than convincing Liz to go against Austin. Austin has said that if he, Liz, and Vanessa end up in the F3 that he doesn’t want to have to make the decision and would throw it to Vanessa and Liz to decide. That would tell me that if he’s forced in to the choice then he might feel obligated to take Liz, not Vanessa. Meanwhile John has told Vanessa he doesn’t want to go to the end with Steve since the Jurors like Steve more than they like John and he thinks his chances are better against her. So, um. Yeah.
What would you do? Target Austin and Liz in this round or go against John and Steve? One side must be split up. We’ll know more tonight, but in the meantime what would you do? Cast your vote in our poll below and then share your thoughts while we wait for the Feeds to return.
Considering the Vegas gambling deal was brought up again last night between Austin and Van with Van stating she was “Fine with the 50k second place money” and Austin stating he was “Still on for the Vegas deal” why wouldn’t she take the showmance? Just proves IMO that the “stupid mistakes” are actually well thought out, contrived decisions.
I don’t have the feeds but it just doesn’t seem to me like anyone is “THAT” lucky (as Vanessa) so I tend to think she has mulled every scenario over and made a thoughtful decision. She plays every week’s scenario’s out,whether or not she is HoH. I just don’t think anyone has that kind of dumb luck.
That’s what I think. She has played the middle ground all season and attempted to make side deals (even illegal ones at times) with those she thought would be the strongest at the end. Some say I can’t fault her for playing the game. I say I can fault her for breaking the rules and not owning her game. It is after all my opinion…
If it was so illegal for her to offer money to the house-guests, then they would’ve kicked her out right then and there. They didn’t. Other than that, what rules has she supposedly ‘broken?’ And what does not owning her game have to do with anything? Does she really have to own her game all the time? If she sees that it’s a risk to keep playing the way she has, then it’s up to her to assess whether to change her plans or not.
She was shut down, told CBS would not tolerate it and told any further talk of bribery would result in her eviction.
Exactly, if it was soooo illegal, like JR thinks, they wouldn’t have even given her a warning, they would’ve just sent her packing. I think if any one of the other house-guests would’ve bribed others with money, I think they would’ve gotten a warning as well.
I realize that nothing Vanessa does is wrong in her fan’s eyes. This is my opinion as I stated and this board is a free space to post it.
I know this is a free space to post. I haven’t told you not to post. We are allowed to post and say that we disagree as well. That’s what you’ve done. That’s what I’ve done. Its one of the reasons we have these discussion boards.
I’m not saying I was okay with her trying to offer the twins money, I would never even fathom doing that so I would never condone it. But I would never fault her for that one mistake. And she got reprimanded by the people in charge, so I don’t see why people are still bringing it up as if it’s the worse thing anyone could’ve done in the game.
This is my explanation for why I think it is so terrible, take it for what it’s worth…
Imagine every future episode now being tainted by the prospect of on day 1 (or any day) 2 or more HG getting together and privately discussing (away from the camera’s watchful eye) going to F2 or F3 or even F4 and splitting the $300k instead of actually playing for it as it seems this season has been. Or having an independently wealthy (as in Van) player “buy out” players… That IMO ruins the game for everyone.
I think the big difference between your scenario and what Vanessa did was that she was offering her own money. The HG’s in your scenario are splitting up the prize money. I think it was nice of her to back off CBS can’t tell her what to do with her own money. She found a loophole and good for her These reality shows are partially rigged anyway, IMO less this year than past seasons unless you believe that CBS already has a TV show for Van in place
Plus, Austin really does deserve to lose all his money if he is the winner this year.
Actually she was at one time talking about giving /splitting some of her winnings if she wins. That’s why she got warned by production. She wouldn’t of been warned for offering her own money.
I think I have 2 things confused. One she talked about Austins backing her in a casino if he won BB and another she offered one of the twins 10 grand for something game related. I thought she got spanked for offering the 10 grand
Actually, there were several instances of foul. The first was a split the money if Van and Austin won and take it to Vegas and let Van gamble with it. This being where she outed herself to Austin about being a wealthy poker player. The second included Liz and also gambling prize money and the third was Paying off Julia 20K if she was voted out.
Furthermore, the last sentence in my post did include the “scenario” of an independently wealthy player bribing other HG. That is probably the worst scenario of them all considering the fact that Vanessa is the only one cast that can afford to bribe anyone!
So are the producers now supposed to only cast players that can ALL afford to bribe or NONE that can?
I skip over all comments made by the fanatic Vanessa fan above. You’ll enjoy yourself a lot more here if you do the same :D
Yep I do the same.
I think the producers really like her. They can not fix it but can let her get away with more and do.
They like the drama she creates because good or bad it creates ratings for them
Wouldn’t it be nice if the producers kicked her out of the game, giving the HOH to JMac.
Since they’re on such a tight schedule there’s no chance of that happening I’m sure.
It would have been great if they would have done it when she first did the deed so to speak. Now it’s too late and too many people would cry foul unfortunately…
No, cuz Vanessa didn’t want to leave and everyone does whats he says. Also she was the best players and biggest form of drama, they weren’t gonna kick her off BB then give her a new show on CBS lol.
she*, don’t wanna sound mean here lol
The time to own her game is in final 2. That is when she almost has to step up and speak about it. However now she is becoming the comp beast of season along with the strategy queen so if she does make F2 I don’t see anyway around awarding her the win. But I do think certain things the juror may want her to own up to. And at that point I think she knows it is time to reveal her cards.
I agree. And if she is not playing for money, why knock someone else out that needs the money and tell stupid Julie to tell the jury she is nice. If she does not care, get rid of her. I think Austin would drop Liz for the money
Vanessa doesn’t just have blind luck. She’s crazy smart. She thinks a lot, probably too much sometimes, but it has worked in her favor so far. So haters can’t fault her.
It’s no doubt that she’s the best player of this season. If the first 6 people who were evicted this season (Jace, Da’Vonne, Jeff, Audrey, Jason, Clay), were in the house with Vanessa as opposed to the ones who actually made the final 7 with Vanessa ( Julia, Liz, Austin, Steve, Johnny, James) then I’d suppose Vanessa would have a harder time making it through but I have no doubts that she would be able to do it. She has come out from the fire unscathed a few times these past weeks. This girl deserves more credit than she’s been given.
I’ll give Vanessa credit, as I have in the past. she is playing the game. I do not like several things she has done, but you have to acknowledge, that girl plays the game non stop. I know her mind is constantly thinking, assessing different scenarios, etc. Vanessa has not been mean, like she was, and it might kill me to say this, but I’m actually admiring her abilities to continually come out smelling like a rose even when they all know she is gonna win if she gets to F2.
If she gets there. I’m going to laugh when she gets evicted in final 3 by either Austin or JMac.
lol, I was just thinking that I didn’t clarify how badly I do not want her to win. I’m still pulling for JMac to kick it in gear
I wonder how Liz will feel after the show when she finds out Austin and Vanessa had a F2 deal from the beginning of the show? Not very romantic I’m sure.
I think she knows. When they had that blow up over the POV he told her about it.
The fact that Austin is choosing to increase his winnings via Vanessa being more important than Liz might make her feel a little used and I wouldn’t blame her.
.
I would love to see the following poll here at BBN:
What do you think will happen if Austin gives Vanessa $250,000 bucks to stake her in a poker game?
.
A. She loses all the money.
B. Vanessa wins big and forgets to give Austin any of the winnings.
.
Only a lunatic would trust Vanessa with their money.
C. Only a lunatic would trust Vanessa with their money.
Or the rumors are true and it’s rigged for her to win to promote her new show.
Don’t like Austin or Van but if I was Austin I wouldn’t fall for that crap Van is feeding him, I’d say “Okay, lets shake on it” meanwhile I’ll let Julia know “we can win F2 and leave Van in the dust, we’ll take the $500K & $50K” just know Van is going to fight tooth & nail at F3 but it’s still us 2 against her and Van may get us F3 over Steve/JMac.
Vanessa beats Austin in the end, imo.
I don’t see why she doesn’t do one of each…
That is a good idea
I totally agree. My speech would be …I have chosen one from each so you can fight for your side. Taking to me from each side seals her fate. If Steve or Jmac wins veto and takes himself OFF he could win HOH and out her up for eviction next week
Why would you risk pissing off all 4 people rather than taking a stand against just two
Squid ward from spongebob square pants needs to. When she wares those beanie things and big glasses that’s who she looks like.
I think Van can beat Austin and Liz in comp, so I think she should go after Steve to evict. Don’t think she can beat him.
She should realize if she takes Liz or Austin with her to final 2, Julie and Liz or Austin would vote against her giving at least 2 to nothing against her and whoever else they convince
OK Vanessa time to use that brain of yoursome and make the best move possible.
I would put up one of each. If she wins the veto, she would probably get to break a tie vote and send whoever she wants home.
Exactly.
My thoughts as well. And, just think of all the scenarios that can develop involving the PoV!
I would guess that is what she is going to do, based on the beginning of her speech excerpt. It sounds like she’s been reading about Solomon.
IDK if that’s her best move, could piss off both sides, (although JMac and Steve would be fine and just follow her blindly). But in that scenario she should put up Austin and Steve as her biggest physical and mental threat, and then tank the PoV and let who ever wins win and the other side sucks for them.
If she puts one from each side then she will have to be the tie breaker and she doenst want that.
If she doesn’t target the Austin & Liz, then she deserves to lose!!!
Would like her to target Austin and Liz and I think she should strategically. But there’s also a case for her targeting JMac and LIz. She is less able to control them like she can Steve and Austin and I think she realizes that. Especially if Austin is gone, Liz is more likely to think for herself than Austin who thinks what VAnessa tells him to.
But she is right when she says that John and Steve won’t choose her over the other in final 3. The same can be said for Liz and Austin. However, I really think she should target John and Steve, because if Vanessa makes it to the final 2 with one of them, she’s less likely to win. If she’s in the final 2 with Austin or Liz, those juror members would be stupid to vote for either Austin or Liz over Vanessa. I think Vanessa’s chances of winning are easier if she sticks it out with that big risk in the house: Austin and Liz. And if she survives over them, she’s a beast! (in a good way, haters).
I would think she’d put up JMac and Steve so she keeps Austin and the twins happy in hopes they will vote for her, while telling Steve and JMac the plans is to target Austin after the PoV, then tank in the PoV and let whoever wins it be safe and tell the other side ‘sorry you had a chance’. From there idk who she’d want out, but that’d be a pretty safe move for her in the meantime.
Although IMO her targets should be Steve and Austin, the best physical competitor and the best mental competitor of her 4 options.
I could care less who wins from these idiots!
Horrible season, I didn’t have the chance to root for anyone in the house.
Producers have ruin these past 2 seasons!’
Yes they did.
The split makes the most sense, put up the two you want gone, and let then POV play out and know you get ton pick who goes home when the vote splits. It’s outside her normal gameplay, but she wisely won the HOH so she would get the power to set the F4. I’m betting austin goes, he is the only one who might beat her in a physical comp final 3 and then she hopes for Steve to go next. Shes gotta believe she will beat JMAC on gameplay and out talk Liz.
She runs the house each week as the HoH, why do they even have the competition? lol
best answer!
She should put up Steve & Austin.
they are too stupid to boot her out! this is her best choice she can manipulate, bully intimidate them into taking HER to final 2.
None of this matters to Vanessa. She has a deal with CBS to host a TV show called “Poker Face” from Las Vegas this fall. Google, “does Vanessa Rousseu have a CBS show this fall?” CBS has set us all up. I for one, will not be watching that show because I feel CBS and Vanessa has hoodwinked viewers. It makes me think that all the BB seasons were fixed and I feel disappointed, betrayed and disgusted by the charade. I really enjoyed BB and have watched it since Season 1. Now, everything on the show is suspect to me. I don’t think Vanessa is slated to actually win. That would be too obvious but her choice of targeting the boys instead of the showmance is such a lame move. The next eviction will take out one of the guys, then it’s 3 against 1 for the final 3. Out goes Vanessa leaving Liz and Austin to enjoy $50,000 and $500,000 and Vanessa with a TV show. BOGUS!
The show will be her gambling with to 500k she wins lol
I checked out an article about her and the new show, and here’s just a bit of what I found …
“Big Brother 17” spoilers are in, and if they are right it looks like the Vegas professional poker player, Vanessa Rousso, will win the game. And that’s not all; it appears BB17 producers rigged the game to ensure their pick (Vanessa) will secure a big win on the finale night. Is it possible that CBS planned for Vanessa to win it all?
“It all comes down to the credibility of an undisclosed inside source. A cameraman on the set of “BB17,” claimed that the show fixed it for Vanessa to win the prize in order to promote her new CBS show, “Poker Face.” He claimed that she was fed inside information – including production revealing to her when she was a target in the house – giving her a huge advantage in the game. If it is true, that could explain how she seems to know exactly how each of the houseguests is feeling about her and their position in the game.”
Check out more about this on Celeb Dirty Laundry. It’s kind if nauseating, if it’s true.
That Dirty Laundry is filled with a bunch of crap. Every year someone says the shows fixed. SMH
Agreed. Just like when they thought it was rigged for Amanda, as an example. But to Koko’s credit, she did say “if” it’s true. Didn’t just blindly believe it.
Oh I know that. Just saying don’t believe everything you read.
Trust me that’s what I say too lol. I would even say don’t believe most that you read, with the internet’s tendency to lie and exaggerate just to generate hits and buzz.
Even if it’s not rigged for Vanessa to win, it was a poor decsision by CBS to include her in the cast of Big Brother. It still makes them look guilty of rigging it for publicity.
I haven’t seen any evidence that there is such a show in the works, aside from that one conspiracy theory saying that’s why they want Vanessa to win. Have you? I can’t imagine anyone at CBS wanting Vanessa to host a show.
Ratings would probably be as bad as Freaky Frankie’s were on his one-off special, really, really bad. CBS must like to gamble with their profits, too.
KSJB,too funny, forgot about that one, you are soooooright!
Vanessa isn’t so much of a master manipulator as she is a lucky one. The few techniques she does know just happen to be the perfect ones to use in this house full of clueless, spineless morons.
If I may, I would like to paste below an explanation of one technique that she uses and I used in a previous thread about the last veto comp to help explain it (the one where she manipulated Julia). I also showed how she did the damage control. Here it is:
This has been not so much great gameplay on Vanessa’s part than it is that the twins are completely clueless and very easy to short circuit. Vanessa also knows and uses a manipulation technique that few people know about. Knowledge is power and since no other houseguest seems to know about this stuff, it is like shooting fish in a barrel for someone who does, I am going to explain this manipulation technique a bit, in summary, now.
When Vanessa put Julia on the spot during the veto comp it wasn’t even hard to do. It worked in this case with Vanessa giving Julia more than one thing to think about in short succession. This locked Julia up by overloading her mind. It literally put her, deliberately, into a mild mental shock. Then she literally becomes open to suggestion and easy to program. Anyone can do it to her, it is no special skill of Vanessa. It is a learned manipulation technique.
Here is how it is done (oh and the more emotionally charged the situation is when you do it, the better this works; timing is everything):
1) Say a few things in very rapid succession that normally require some time and some thought to process and make sure that the statements are conflicting as well. (Bonus points for making those statements about things that you know the target(s) are emotionally attached to also) This will confuse the target(s).
2) As soon as they become confused, immediately (no delay is critical, this must happen fast like a whirlwind) give them the answer to the conflicting statements. But give them YOUR answer, your Trojan manipulative answer. Since this answer relieves the mental conflict, they will often accept it outright especially if there is time pressure added to the induced confusion that you caused (and there certainly was in the veto comp, wasn’t there! After, in the bathroom, Vanessa tweaked the tactic and used it again but this time she created the time pressure artificially by doing the above steps, but then she quickly changed the subject–all while bombarding them with more information wrapped with intensity and emotion and even the threat of dumping still more information on them. She even said as much!). The key is to hit hard and fast.
3) Since the target(s) are not given time to resolve the conflicting information themselves, they will more often than not just accept the Trojan Horse “solution” that you gave them without their even realising it. Since almost nobody embraces inner conflict and it is so uncomfortable, even torture, any path to relief seems to be the right one in the moment, And if you play it right, they won’t even realise that you fed them the Trojan answer– and if they eventually do figure it out, it won’t matter, it will be too late.
Please, go back and watch the scenes again with all of this in mind and I am certain that you will see exactly how this works now that I have explained it.
This is not a talent, it is a skill that can be learned by anybody. It simply requires some confidence and some stupid targets in order to pull off.
Here we go again with you undermining the awesome game this girl has played. Are you that upset that Vanessa has done well in the game? She hasn’t been lucky. Did you not see that time that she was on the block with Shelli? That wasn’t pure luck that she survived with no votes to evict her. That was strategy. That was the closest she had come to being evicted and she hasn’t been put up on the block since. How is that just pure luck? I don’t understand you! Vanessa is a game theorist and a poker player for goodness sake! She has used those skills that she has learned to play this game. She’s not just a lucky person.
Would have more respect for Vanessa’s game play if she owned her behaviour but her tears and protestations that she hasn’t lied (there’s a lie right there), that she has integrity blah blah are ridiculous. She’s abusive and a bully. At least, Will, Derrick, Dan admit to what they did. Even Evil Dick who I hated did pretend to be other than what he was.
That last sentence should say that Dick did NOT pretend…..
According to sources, she’s also being helped by production and being given inside information because CBS wants her to win.
What else explains why the Goblins were so dumb about Vanessa and the SS alliance?
People thought the show was rigged for Amanda (of McRanda fame) to win as well because she was friends with producer Allison Grodner. Amanda as we all know was evicted and didn’t win. I’m not saying production doesn’t ever tip the scales because I believe they do, but just keep that in mind.
I would not call manipulation, intimidation, threatening, bullying awesome game play!
Agreed.
Vanessa appears to suffer from Narcissistic Personality Disorder. Narcissists are predatory and manipulative, evincing empathy as a tool but incapable of feeling empathy. She may well be the best strategist, outplaying a house full of non-narcissists, but this would not be remarkable. You place a piranha in a tank with 15 goldfish and it is no surprise what the outcome will be.
The producers know who they are casting. They submit candidates to a barrage of psychological tests for liability reasons. Anti-social behavior such as narcissism, sociopathy and psychopathy are detectable, not absolutely so, but it is remarkable how much psychological examinations can apprehend.
I stopped watching the show about 3 or 4 weeks ago when it became apparent the ‘piranha’ was going to eat her way to the final 3. I’m not keen on watching narcissists get rewarded for their narcissism. I check in on this forum for spoilers to see if the goldfish beat back the predator–now that is drama.
Now, it is arguable that all of us are at least a little narcissistic. But the twins preoccupation with themselves, or Shelli’s incredulous self-centeredness (“We don’t deserve to be on the block!”) or Jessie (muscle head from a previous season who hosted the POV comp) completely in love with the mirror and seemingly always flexing his biceps, these people do not take their egocentrism to the pathological level whereby you manipulate people for gain. Of course, BB is a game where deception and manipulation are virtually necessary to get far in the game, but it is also a living laboratory whereby we witness who is playing the game, including all the lies and deceptions, and who is revealing how deep the narcissism runs.
Vanessa is a predator. A most telling feature is she appears to believe her own lies. She may well be the sharpest knife in the drawer–though she has played a very undisciplined game–but she is disconnected from feeling empathy for others and this affects her ability to process reality, which includes what she believes to be true.
I can’t say I am a super fan, but I know who Dr. Will is and Evil Dick and who Dan is, and I would say all 3 of these players score high for NDP. I can’t really comment on Dan as I kinda tuned out that season, but Dr. Will and Evil Dick strike me as people who have some sense that they are wired for hurtful manipulation and it seems to register, however slightly, within their consciousness. Mike Boogie, another winner, it’s no surprise he and Dr. Will were best buds inside and outside the house because he seems much like Dr. Will, though he strikes me as capable of maybe a smidge more empathy.
Not so with Vanessa. Any anguish she feels comes about only to the degree she realizes her ability to manipulate is blunted. In a reality series geared toward showcasing human nature and social interaction, she is the most disturbingly pathological in her anti-social personality. Admire her for her cunning, if you must, but perhaps the people we venerate are the ones who throw us shade for possessing the shortcomings we subconsciously recognize in ourselves.
Well said indeed! I recognized NPD during her first HOH reign… Anyone who has had the misfortune of encountering an NPD in real life will easily recognize her.
Absolutely brilliant assessment and I could not agree more!
In other words, she plays on their feelings digs deep by saying “I did it in the best interest for you”, “I could not win first was only thinking of you” “if you are lying to me when I have been totally honest and loyal to you” with threats, bullying, intimidation, manipulation and over the top crying. This is not game play, this is learned behaviour to get her way.
Yes, EXACTLY. :)
I agree. When you’re playing against a bunch of recruits it’s not hard to do what she does. Lucky for sure.
Thank you.
I think she she stay with Steve and John as they can boot her out. Austin and Liz are still under Vanessa’s spell! They just don’t get it she is poison!
STOP THE DRAMA Vanessa. Just nominate the strongest from each pair (Steve and Liz) and Shut the Hell Up (yes, I hate her).
Liz a stronger competitor than Austin, gotta be the best joke I’ve read all day. She should put up Austin as the biggest physical threat, and Steve as the biggest mental threat if she is going to one one from each side.
Umm, I’m not sure how many HoH comps Austin has won but I don’t think it is 3 or more ( as Liz has won 3), so, yes, she IS the better of the 2
Lol.She is the queen bee. Will someone please dethrone her ass.
Target the power couple Austin and Liz, if you don’t,your going out the door next.!
I’m hoping she goes out the door next.
Just using the merits of abilities to win HOH and POV, the smart target for Vanessa is Austin and Liz. With Liz preferably, the target this week. Vanessa cannot play for HOH next week and is most vulnerable. That is the time that everyone else if they are using their heads will be gunning for her. Would Vanessa rather play for POV against Johnny Mac, Steve and Austin or would she rather have Liz, Austin and Johnny Mac going against her in POV? The toughest combo is Liz, Austin, Steve although, if Johnny Mac and Steve wind up on the block, it is safe to assume that Steve would be the target this week. Using Vanessa’s action as a basis, which is saving Liz this week, I have to assume she trusts Austin and Liz more to keep her safe so, Johnny Mac and Steve probably will wind up in the hot seats this week.
“Vanessa Rousso navigated the sides of the house while avoiding committing too deeply to one group or the other”.
Really? Lol. (In regards to the Dark Moon alliance) “Dude I would like even get a Dark Moon tattoo when this is over”
“Austin’s Angels are the sh*t that’s all I gotta say”
There are other examples of when she was painfully awkward in her speech when trying to make others comfortable in trusting her loyalty to them. She’s said a few things (these two were just off the top of my head, without thinking much) that probably made others feel she was committing deeply or at least attempting to sell that.
She’s obviously been a decent player, as she’s gotten this far and has had an influence on a lot of game decisions, but I continue to feel people are significantly over-crediting her. She really hasn’t been that great, and if she’s outplayed others in the house, I feel that more speaks to the weakness of the play of others. She deserves some credit, absolutely, but not as much as I’ve seen people seem to want to give her. At least that’s my opinion, and to each their own.
You mentioned it: Vanessa has been a decent player. In a season full of terrible players, decent is still much better than most of the others.
Yea, I could get on board with that thought. But I personally can’t give too much credit to someone who’s just decent amongst the terrible. Same way, for example, I don’t call a sports highlight that amazing, even if the offensive play was impressive, if I feel the defense flubbed badly to enable it to be successful.
Maybe that’s just me, but I stand by it.
It’s not just you. But people are giving credit because it’s actually hard to play with a strategy when nobody else around you does.
Except for Becky and Shelli, nobody who is in Jury now played a strategic game, they all were guided by their emotions.
So while Vanessa shouldn’t be credited as a master mind, she is a good player and for that she might deserve the 500k most
Yeah out of who’s left, it’s sadly true that she may deserve the money the most, based on gameplay and without any bias for who one’s favourite is, without factoring in (as I don’t think you should) a player’s pre-existing financial situation.
I agree also that Shelli and Becky attempted to have a strategy. Even James ran on emotions, on vengeance, whether he’ll ever admit it or not.
My opinion also. Look at who’s she’s playing against. And the tactics she uses to play the game.
If she wins the game she still won’t take the title of “worst winner” in my book as that’ll probably still stay with Maggie from Season 6, among a couple of others, but I can’t help but laugh at the thought of her being anywhere close to the same ranks as Derrick, Dan or Will, for example.
Oh she was bad. What about Jun? Remember when it was her and Allison and nobody wanted to vote for either of them. And when they came out nobody cheered.
Haha yea I almost forgot about that. That was pretty funny. Probably slipped my mind because I only casually watched Season 3 and 4, was almost a proper full-time viewer for 5, but finally came around from 6 and on. I do remember that Season 4 finale though that you’re talking about.
Vanessa is too chicken to put up Austin and Liz. I hope whoever stays, Steve or John, they win HOH and put her up and win the Veto and get rid of her. Nobody except James played with guts the whole year but Liz, Austin and Julie also played stupid. They have been afraid of Vanessa too. I want Steve or Johnny M to win and would like them to be final 2, but at least get rid of Vanessa. She doesn’t gamble, she lies and intimidates and nobody left is smart enough to get it
That’s part of the problem if she keeps Liz & Austin, there will still be a showmance that should take priority over evicting her. Asinine. About as asinine as evicting Julia.
Vanessa is probably thinking that Liz is more dumb and therefore easier to manipulate into screwing over Austin.
Isn’t this the Veto that Donny won last year to make it to Final 4? Maybe John is just dumb enough to follow in his footsteps. He has no ability to say what he really needs to say or manipulate Vanessa into thinking.
I just hope he’s not dumb enough to do what shes going to ask him to do .. and that’s throw the Veto.
She is a bi-polar hypocrite without an ounce of integrity. I was laughing listening to all the demands she put on Austin and Liz and they both are just going right along with her demands. She’s stupid if she thinks they won’t take each other in a final 3 if given the chance. My hope is JMac wins POV then wins HOH in the final 4. Puts Vanessa up and tells her karma!
That’s what irks me about people over-crediting Vanessa. Is there supposed to be some applause for her so-called strategy of everytime she’s confronted she goes high-pitched, starts crying and says “Oh my god how can you say that. I’m a good person I’m not f***ing evil”. It’s head-shaking and people are applauding it? Did Dan or Derrick resort to this crap? Did anybody who won the game let alone two of the greats? It’s a borderline disgrace and it’s ridiculous that these players just let it happen. Becky and John were the only ones catching on and saying enough already, and if John wasn’t alone at the time of agreeing to work with Vanessa, and thus had any other choice, I doubt he commits to work with her. Probably agrees just to smile and nod for the cameras but then takes his shot if he gets it.
Exactly. I loved when she was asking him to give her reasons not to put him up and he said you want to put me up do it. He’s not going to bow down to her and I love it. You’re right the winners that were deserving didn’t have to cry and throw tantrums before nominating someone. They had a target and just went after them. No excuses.
Yeah and they didn’t turn into crying guilt trippers when they were confronted about something. I agree with you completely but I can’t up-vote you because I’m posting as a guest lol. That’s one reason John is my favourite, his refusal to bow down to Vanessa like the Austwins do whenever Vanessa has any power.
That’s ok lol
Hey Lavendar, I agree with you about Jmac just telling her to go for it. In effect, he’s saying “go F yourself, I’m not playing your mind games. ” People are saying that many of the hgs played with their emotions. Vanessa is the biggest emotional player EVER! John, imo, has played with no emotional reaction at all. He’s like a Cheshire cat just waiting to pounce on the big fat mouse. If he gets that chance by winning POV, watch and wait. It will be fireworks heaven! Jmac for the win…
How much does she really want to push her luck? Van’s deal is a hard sell and sounds greedy. Her cards are on table. Everybody knows what she’s up to, and they’re all thinking the same thing.
I just wish they would all get together and talk but I guess with her being HOH nows not the time. I’m praying John wins POV and HOH. Watch Austin and Liz spill everything to JMac. Then finally we’ll have something to watch on the feeds. The feeds have been very boring 90% of the time this summer. You know me and my drama. Lol
You want drama?..I have a friend I would like to introduce to you ..Her name is Jasmine. lol (do you like to read?)
Hahaha you crack me up. I seen she’s back…..
f r i e n d….a person whom one knows and with whom one has a bond of mutual affection. :)
last week it’s the word “bully” now it’s “friend” lol All from Karen’s Dictionary.. thanks friend.
Absolutely my pleasure. I’m so proud of myself for finding the online dictionary. We’ll try another new word soon. I really love the one with acronyms. AAYF:D
You have to wonder if those “meds” she is taking is for a person who is bi-polar.
I’ve been listening for a slip when she says time for my meds on what she is taking.
I just want to see her get some help.
I think she is bi-polar and possibly a pathological liar too. She is definitely a narcissist.
I would even venture to say she’s a sociopath after watching her all summer.
Yes to all three.
I think Austin and Liz were just giving her lip service and agreeing with whatever she was throwing out. Does anyone really think Vanessa believes they would go along with her ridiculous demands?
One of my favorites had to be Vanessa saying “I’m a game theory expert”…I guess that’s an easy sell to two airheads like Liz and Julia.
I’m stunned that she would put up Steve and JMac. I guess the best we can hope for is that Steve or JMac wins POV and then she’ll have to put up Liz or Austin
I don’t even try to understand this dog and pony show anymore. I just laugh at all of the nonsensical decisions. Gotta’ pull teeth to get any entertainment from this bunch. You doing good, ER?
Don’t matter she’s the tie breaker in the vote and already comitted. Therefore to switch suddenly and vote liztin out would make 3 new enemies instead of 1.
Vanessa’s best move was to not win the HOH at all this week. Liz would have pushed Austin into getting even with Steve (and John) or evicting her sister had Austin/Liz won. John, had he won, would have broken up the Liz/Austin connection to get to final three with Steve and Vanessa. NOW, Vanessa is forced to “play her cards” (thank you for the applause to my POKER reference) and choose a side. So, after this eviction, she will have someone gunning for her.
Furthermore, Steve/John would have been versus Austin/Liz this week, and Vanessa would have slid by because she is “alone.” Not a good poker move winning HOH.
I think it boils down to winning Veto next week.
Vanessa will put John and Steve up and send Steve packing. Steve is a showing for victory. Everyone knows this. This will ensure her safety if Lizton wins HoH next week. Vanessa’s goal is to go to the final 2 with John as its her best chance to win. This is logically her best move.
If she sends Steve packing she sends the person Austin and Liz claim to want out next. Then their target has to be Vanessa, especially if the win HoH. That would mean JMac will not win a single HoH until maybe the last one. That would be a difficult record for JMac to use to convince the jury he should win.
Gotta win to win right. Steve is Vanessas biggest threat. He’s gonna crush the mind/memory/puzzle and days Como and wants her out anyway. He mumbled in hoh about his fears of her last week. Austin and Liz are like whatever in that comp.
She should put up Steve and JMac because for sure Austin and Liz are more mesmerized by her than Steve and JMac. But at the same time, I think all of the players are going after Vanessa. She has 4 HoHs and multiple POVs. She may not be liked but her resume is way about everyone else’s and she can claim she has been running the house every week for weeks.
I guess whast I am saying is it doesn;t matter who she puts up because if she does not win the next POV she is out the door next.
If everyone left in the house does not evict her they are bigger morons than Julia was for picking Austin in the POV comp!
Anyone who plays this game, should realize the HOH this week was a gamble, its the veto that counts this final week. Vanessa isn’t even playing the best game, she nullified it as a player, when she started bribing others, as far I am concerned. I wouldn’t rank her. but apparently cheaters are celebrated these days, sucks for them.
We’re voting Austin/LIz as should nom almost 90/10 so doesn’t that mean she’ll put up JMac/Steve? With her you can count on it being opposite to the vote of what we think b/c you know she’s a game strategist expert?
Sad part is this shouldn’t even be a question. If she were playing the game smart, the showmance would already be split up. That said, she’s foolish to think she’d be able to get between Liztin before John/Steve. Vans game has been circling the drain the past couple weeks…
She’s probably worried if she breaks up Liz and Austin, she will lose their jury votes, so she will go after Steve/John this week, and have someone else try and break them up next week.
based on all the vile things the Austwins have said about Jmac and Steve, how they don’t deserve the money, etc… I think she has their vote no matter what as long as they aren’t sitting next to her F2. They have even said this to her face.
Ahaaa…”you said all the Vile things” come on, please. Johns the taxi driver, and serves a self proclaimed btw, nerd. They’re not bad at all. They also said Vanessas NUTS disagree 100.
english translation please…
ha! no kidding. I have no idea what he said.
Sorry George what I’m trying to say is, they aren’t really that bad. I know they are not hateful and the twins are great. They say stupid comment about meg crying (seems to be the big one) and 2 seconds later it’s forgotten and they are chasing bats in the backyard. Followed by cooking for everyone,listening to everyone laughing with everyone.I was raised in an Italian family my father used to tell his sister awful things and she’d reply I’m going to claw your evil eyes out. 5 min later eating saying grace hugs etc. I just don’t take the idle comets that seriously is all.
I have to wonder if Vanessa’s meds are helping her keep track of all the crap she is spewing. I can barely keep up with what she has going and with who.
“I swear on Mel i’m telling you the truth” tears… vomitfest
….as she lies…
The house should meet without Vanessa and discuss all the crap that she has been involved with since day one. They all should discuss the fact that she has a F2 alliance with everyone in the house. After that is discussed they should call her in and tell her to her face what a liar and bully she is, and as they now leave the house to enter the Jury house they will all tell the house guests in the jury house how she betrayed all of them. That she has been involved in all the evictions, and that she betrayed everyone in the house.
Oh yea I said Austin Liz John and steve should have pulled her in the hammock room, chair in the middle and one by one professed the lies and back stabbing she’s done to each then sprint out of the room into backyard while her head explodes.
Vanessa is batshit crazy!!!! Integrity!!!!
It’s actually kind of sad. Vanessa plays so hard that it doesn’t even seem fun for her. Then she will just gamble it away in about one week. My guess is she doesn’t even pee unless she considers how it could be strategic. It works I guess but it kind of ruins the game.
Funny
It’s Bedlam in V-Cranes brain. And Austin knows just how to stroke her. Give her power, give her your heart, give her promises from the after life, rince repeat, re begin the cycle.
There are risks galore this week but for me Vanessa should now cast her lot with the John side of the house and take her chances,better odds going to the final 2 with those 3 than with Liz and Austin,he is in love and she can’t quit crying long enough to make a right decision.
Austin and Liz don’t seem like they are in love to me, body language, etc. They are playing it out and would easily throw each other under the bus when they’ve outlasted their value to the game.
Really, i think Liz doesnt get enough credit. That’s just me. That’s alot of nights to be glued to someone for playing them emotions up. May not be wedding g bound but after Veto win when Austin went Alpha adrenaline for a while. He said who wants to congratulate me cuz he felt betrayed. She, even though knew her fate, walked over ducked up her pride (huge moment. People don’t do that sh$/) and said “I’ll congratulate you” even though her doom was decided.
There’s a big difference between love and someone to fool around with. When it comes down to the money it will be a whole new ball game.
I’m sure you must be familiar with the term hooker…not saying she is but it’s amazing what people will do for half a million bucks.
And Austin, for every hooker, there is a john, but they like money too (can pay for more hookers) and in his case fame as well as fortune.
Just saying…they haven’t gone that far but the concept is similar especially if they like each other…I’m only questioning the love thing. Lately they are really getting on each others nerves so it appears.
Yes agree for sure, but they had that talk. He said f-u when it comes to money or her she said same, they laughed and said they’d enjoy it together. Will they share ot, he’ll no. But maybe one trip to the Cayman islands wouldn’t hurt, that’s as long as he doesn’t get tied up with a stewerdes a mile up.
Liz told Vanessa she would take her on the luxury trip (that alone dismisses her as deserving)…I’m waiting for Vanessa to drop that on Austin.
U believe that. I laughed. No way she’s taking her. Wasn’t it.you who come need on her contorted face when Vanessa threw out those nut laced terms and conditions. How do you really feel about Vanessa Liz?
I don’t believe it and I’m sure Vanessa didn’t but if Austin hears it at this stage of paranoia he can’t unhear it true or not. Being naïve again Brian.
Comemted noT come need. Below
Are you talking in code now??
You lost me at hooked and Johns, man. They’re kids. Easy….but last point, recieved.
Don’t be naïve. Kids?
Tell that to Liz’s nana. Have you seen some of the youtube videos? Don’t do the crime if you can’t do the time.
And Austin’s girlfriend back home? Is that how you break up with someone? If he would do that on national tv he is capable of anything…he wants the fame more than the money but winning the money will give him more photo ops.
It’s time to be real…no point in sugar coating it.
All cool, no I didn’t see that Utube stuf??? Curious. I can’t comment on the Austin thing but like I said I don’t see wedding bells but ypu know crazier things have become bigger messes. Lol
Let’s just say I saw a clip of something (in addition to all the rumours which I now believe to be true) and if that was my daughter or granddaughter I would never get over it. He should keeps his hands over the covers and she shouldn’t “react” the way she did knowing she is being filmed 24/7. Enough said.
Now you know where I’m coming from (well, someone’s coming from).
I gotta get out of here…this is no way for a 60 year old grandmother to talk. Cheers!
Oh I Did See That And I Agree. Peace.
Vanessa needs to put up JMac and Liz because of the potential veto which could wipe out her targeted side (whoever that is). She is closer to Steve and Austin so she shouldn’t rock the boat with them.
Her target should be Austin. Ideally JMac would win veto (Steve would keep Vanessa’s picks the same because ultimately she can break a tie so don’t unlock her cage). Then when JMac comes down she can put up Austin and wave goodbye.
Easy peasy.
I’d like to see JMac, Vanessa and Steve in F3, and then JMac and Steve in F2. If JMac doesn’t upset the apple cart too much he would win.
In an ideal world it is but this is Van Van’s world and it’s twilight zone.
Not bad for alternative thinking best so far but what about the votes or who takes her. I guess at that point Liz and Steve would just have to get over it.
I think Steve and JMac would take her to F2 for reasons I already mentioned…Liz and Austin are taking each other no matter what. Vanessa needs to do what I said…the incentive is better…lol.
She should put up Steve and JMac with the intention of Steve winning the POV (if it is a puzzly sort of thing) and re-nomming Austin or Liz. Much easier to get them out that way without pissing them off as jury votes.
I like my scenario better (below). My way she isn’t picking a side and will have more choices. I’d like to see he rgo to F3 and then out the door. Let her think she’s going to win it and then spin it.
I completely disagree She’s pissing off both sides in your scenario.
No she’s not…she has the deciding vote so she could let each side know she’s on their side. If it wasn’t a tie situation I would agree with you but these guys all know that she has the ultimate choice.
Hmmmm. I didn’t think of the tie. But I still she will be very careful to protect that Austin/Liz relationship, because pissing one off is potentially pissing three jurors off. And I think Vanessa is very aware of the jury in every decision she makes.
That’s partly why I think it’s better to not put all her eggs in one basket. I don’t think Liz gives a toss about Austin and can take cover under Vanessa’s wing…if she gets to the end (hope not)…the votes will be mixed.
As it turns out, she did exactly what I expected.
Me too. She made a big mistake.
No. She committed let’s say. John Steve, I’m putting you up. This severs ties, trust, hopes imediately. Now if John or Steve win veto it’s mute because she puts up Liztin, either or and as the tie breaker vote sends home John or steve whoever did not win veto. Lines been drawn. No way you suddenly say ok, now I want to burn this other bridge too. Austin please step up. Bad move
But she isn’t choosing Austin or Liz because she wants to, but because she has to. Big difference.
She also has to consider Steve and JMac’s jury votes along with their gremlins.
Naaaaa Soph. Austin and liz aren’t dumb she puts them up cuz she has to, ok fine. But then they sit super pretty on the block. Because they are staying. Again she wouldn’t burn 2 sides of the bridge and let it crash in the middle where she stands. She can’t explain in jury I had to put u up. Austin would be like “so what” ur vote is the tie breaker stick with og plan or I’ll sever your head
Do not like Vanessa but if she tales Austin or Liz to the final 2, she will have a harder time winning. If F2 are Liz and her, the Julie, and Austin are 2 votes for Liz. Some jurors are easily persuaded. Same thing if she takes Austin then Liz and Julie will vote for Austin. If Vanessa is F2 with John or Steve the 3 may be votes for her. I want Steve of John to win but I thought Vanessa was smarter than this. Plus of she really is playing for second which is a lie, she just go to jury herself. She claims to be rich. No sport if no money needed in a game played for money. I hope if she is F2 they remember she is rich
D I s a g r e e
I think it’s crazy to even consider Steve and JMac as a couple. At the end of the day they part ways…they are helping each other but I doubt either one would pick the other for F2 because they see each other as the biggest threat to their individual games. I think Vanessa knows this but has to keep the ball bouncing with Austin/Liz because until she puts someone on the block it’s all talk. Liztin however will take each other no matter what…unless of course Austin cheats on her with someone on the production crew…even then you never know.
I thought I got her but certainly I don’t.
But I guess the three of them (Van Van, the Big Troll and his missus) deserve one another. With all the lying, backstabbing, pleading, crying, sh*t talking and thrashing between them, they would make a lovely threesome.
At the end of the day it comes down to this. Who she thinks she can beat in the final 3. She’s already jedi mind bent Julia and thinks Liz isn’t to many noodles stronger. She thinks she can intimidate Austin. And she says she’s good at the menory stuff and has proven to win physical endurance comps twice. The other side, less predictable. She’s stated she can never read Jon severAL times. This scares her.she’s a control freak remember. She knows Steve is dangerous at puzzles mind games BB lure. She can’t controll that. And she has more loyalty from liztin. In my mind it easy. By Steve and john. And yes I like both those guys alot.
But Vanessa is right when she says that John and Steve won’t choose her
over the other in final 3. The same can be said for Liz and Austin.
However, I really think she should target John and Steve, because if
Vanessa makes it to the final 2 with one of them, she’s less likely to
win. If she’s in the final 2 with Liz or Austin, those juror members
would be stupid to vote for either Liz or Austin over Vanessa. I think
Vanessa’s chances of winning are easier if she sticks it out with that
big risk in the house: Liz and Austin (Liz being the stronger player of
the duo, let’s face it, Austin’s won like how many comps compared to
Liz?). And if Vanessa STILL survives over them(seeing as they are
stronger competitors than John and Steve), she’s a beast! (in a good
way, haters).
Did you just rewrite my post?
I posted this hours ago…like around 4 pm.
I think smart play is hedge the bets and one of each. See how veto plays out then from there make the decision if I was in this spot. That way until absolutely had to do it your not making the duo you are targeting known.